Why arguments against pro-contact pedophile arguments are bullshit

[Jim Burton]

"I was a pro-c, so to cure my illness, I SHOT MYSELF IN THE HEAD"

"I killed the abuser in me, now I do the same, FOR SOCIETY"

[FairBlueLove]

Why is AMSC wrong? "It is wrong because once the child learns it is wrong they feel bad."
There might be reasons to oppose AMSC, but that circular logic loop definitely is not one. The funny thing is that the author claims to have originally been pro-c. And THIS is the logic that made him anti-c? WTF...

It would be great if some anti-c here at Mu are/were following this logic and would expand on it. Maybe some anti-c realized the self-defeating logic of circular reasoning, and converted to pro-c?

[BLueRibbon]

Why is AMSC wrong? "It is wrong because once the child learns it is wrong they feel bad."
There might be reasons to oppose AMSC, but that circular logic loop definitely is not one. The funny thing is that the author claims to have originally been pro-c. And THIS is the logic that made him anti-c? WTF...

It would be great if some anti-c here at Mu are/were following this logic and would expand on it. Maybe some anti-c realized the self-defeating logic of circular reasoning, and converted to pro-c?

Mu would be extremely happy to host well-argued anti-contact positions.

I started off with a NOMAP agenda as a naive teen, and while I no longer agree with anti-c personally, I remain quite balanced and I am happy to academically and philosophically engage with everyone from NAMbLA to Virped.

[Fragment]

It’s fascinating how much youth lib can be misinterpreted and leveraged in pro-c rhetoric. My belief that adults have no business interacting in any way but platonically with youth and children is heavily informed by youth lib. Part of my youth lib values is the belief that we have a responsibility to empower youth in a world that disempowers them. One of the ways we can do so is by cultivating the healthiest possible environment for them to nurture their own sexualities. Ensuring they are safe from potential sexual trauma from adults (emphasis on potential) is fundamentally necessary to youth sexual empowerment. Which means, never taking any risk of hurting them sexually/romantically. Never taking any risk of disempowering youth and their sexual development. An actively anti-c mindset is inherent to youth liberty imo. We are challenging our internalized beliefs and myths around adult entitlement to children. Children and youth do have sexualities and we have no right to them.

Here's a nuanced anti-c take that acknowledges the harm in AMSC is potential, rather than guaranteed and also admits that child sexuality is a real thing. The focus is on compatibility and risk. And implicitly the exceptionalism of sex. At this point it feels we're not necessarily talking about legal reform or what acts someone should be held criminally liable for, though. It seems more an argument about what kinds of actions someone focused on justice and equality should engage in. But if AMSC is treated like adultery and condemned without resulting in incarceration, that is definitely an outcome that many pro-c people could be quite content with. We'd be agreeing on policy and merely disagreeing on what it means to be an "ethical boy/girllover" (as the discussions used to go back before the anti-c label was a thing).

Of course, while I'd love to have these conversations I found this statement while browsing an insular community whose members mostly have no interest in interacting with us. I guess for some of the radicals, though, there is no interest in reforming the current system. They want to tear the entire current system down.

[Harlan]

I guess for some of the radicals, though, there is no interest in reforming the current system. They want to tear the entire current system down.

Yes. I like to say that "you can't fill a cup with water from a fire hose". Abolishing the age of consent was possible in the past, but society has gone down the path of victimization. Ironically, in an era of tolerance and political correctness, society has become less tolerant and more hysterical. Political correctness makes society less emotional stable and more infantile. It has forgotten how to listen and be restrained. Therefore, the only way at the moment is the path of gradual expansion of the community and the promotion of gradual reforms.