MAP Forum

So this place actually has kind of bad reputation tbh. But I’m willing to give it the benefit of the doubt:

My name is Clover! I’m trying to get a little bit more involved in the Map community because I’m desperately lonely and hate hiding my true self from the world.

Attractions
I’m mainly into little girls between the ages of 3ish and 12ish. But I also sometimes like slightly older little boys - maybe 8ish to 13ish. When it comes to adults I can tolerate women, but I particularly like cute femboys. Now I’m “anti-contact”, and the rumor is that this place is generally pro-c, but I hope people will be open-minded.

Hobbies & Interests
I like lots of stuff, like cute animals, history, crafts, and comedy. But my biggest hobby BY FAR is AI-generated images, especially realistic ones depicting beautiful little girls! I even started a Zine dedicated to this topic recently, called PROSAIC: Photorealistic Renderings Of Sexy AI Children! Don’t worry, it’s all tasteful art, it’s NOT pornographic. I got into the topic of AI images pretty early on, before most people had heard of it. 🖼 Sadly, there’s been a vicious backlash against this art, and now it’s widely hated, which I think is sad.

Anyways, idk that’s probably the main stuff.

Hello Clover,

It's nice to have you here. Everyone that joins influences the atmosphere of the community and makes it ever more vibrant and dynamic.

Now I’m “anti-contact”, and the rumor is that this place is generally pro-c, but I hope people will be open-minded.

We want this to be a place where people of any contact stance can feel comfortable. The early members tended to lean more pro-c, which means that expressing different opinions could result in a lot of critical replies. But I'm always up for trying to discuss things respectfully.

I hope for a world where instead of "pro-c" and "anti-c" being divided into two teams we can treat discussion around ideal and possible social and legal reform in a more nuanced way. There aren't only two options. And I don't think it's good to pretend things in terms of good/bad or black/white.

The size of the politics forum on this board is well in-line with the smallest forums on the board, and we have had no aggressive conduct incidents to moderate thusfar. I'll be looking to place limitations on political debates if it ever spirals out of control or infects the publicly visible boards here.

There has been a surprising absence of radical pro-c's transitioning from PCMA to MAP Forum as PCMA has declined. They prefer a private space in which to be radical pro-c's.

This suggests to me that MAP Forum is a blank slate, and will be outsize influenced by whoever registers and contributes.

If there is anything re. AOO we can do as a committee (i.e. publicizing examples of censorship, or reporting them to media), we can discuss that. I would also suggest contacting the Prostasia Foundation if you have not already, as they have the established record of working on this topic.

Jim Burton wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:35 am If there is anything re. AOO we can do as a committee (i.e. publicizing examples of censorship, or reporting them to media), we can discuss that. I would also suggest contacting the Prostasia Foundation if you have not already, as they have the established record of working on this topic.

I already sent a personal email, not one on behalf of Mu. I was given a template response and told "they cannot discuss individual cases".

I think there may be ways to escalate that, though. In particular, having them clarify for the MAP community, what kind of content would be deemed unacceptable and why. Surely if they are permitting MAPs to use their site, they would appreciate our input in balancing safety and free expression. Imagine if they got it wrong in the opposite direction and failed to ban someone that was clearly using the site for abusive purposes.

Hello and welcome.

AI is so good at creating images now. I've only used AI to make a few logo's but even then it's impressive how creative they are. I think AI for art is just a new form of art, like the invention of the paint brush and computer.

Hi and welcome!

CloverAntics wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 2:03 am I even started a Zine dedicated to this topic recently, called PROSAIC: Photorealistic Renderings Of Sexy AI Children! Don’t worry, it’s all tasteful art, it’s NOT pornographic. I got into the topic of AI images pretty early on, before most people had heard of it. 🖼 Sadly, there’s been a vicious backlash against this art, and now it’s widely hated, which I think is sad.

Congrats for starting this PROSAIC Zine! I agree with you and Outis. Generative AI is just a new tool, a kind of "inward" photography, where the latent space of the model is explored in search of the visual representations which better express our creativity. If one hates AI art, then I do not see why s/he should not hate photography as well.

Welcome CloverAntics!

So far I have found this forum to be welcoming. I certainly disagree with many members on a variety of topics, but if we are to have a true "union of MAPs" this is always going to be the case. We are just as diverse as every other sexuality. Getting more people of all types to participate is critical if Mu is going to succeed in their goal.

Phossu wrote: ↑Tue Oct 08, 2024 2:17 am I certainly disagree with many members on a variety of topics, but if we are to have a true "union of MAPs" this is always going to be the case. We are just as diverse as every other sexuality. Getting more people of all types to participate is critical if Mu is going to succeed in their goal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Log_Cabin_Republicans

Phossu wrote: ↑Tue Oct 08, 2024 2:17 am So far I have found this forum to be welcoming. I certainly disagree with many members on a variety of topics, but if we are to have a true "union of MAPs" this is always going to be the case. We are just as diverse as every other sexuality. Getting more people of all types to participate is critical if Mu is going to succeed in their goal.

I know I’m kind of stepping into a debate that’s been raging for a long time - but I just feel like there’s a better way to handle things. Instead of focusing on some stupid large-scale ideological infighting, maybe people should have some kind of agreement to put that on the back burner and instead focus on immediate changes that might help MAPs in concrete ways that are actually plausible (ie. removing some stigma surrounding it, better training and understanding from therapists regarding this, better access to this sort of help for MAPs who are struggling with a variety of problems because of this, etc). Idk?

FairBlueLove wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 1:13 pm Congrats for starting this PROSAIC Zine! I agree with you and Outis. Generative AI is just a new tool, a kind of "inward" photography, where the latent space of the model is explored in search of the visual representations which better express our creativity. If one hates AI art, then I do not see why s/he should not hate photography as well.

Aww thank you friend!

Been receiving very mixed reactions, tbh. Even more so than the bans, the ambivalence from some AI artists when it comes to forming a proper community is a bit frustrating

I want people to be able to be friends and chat about this stuff, basically? A proper community! But I know people are very hesitant about this stuff - I mean there is SO much hate out there towards these sorts of images

Outis wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 11:01 am Hello and welcome.

AI is so good at creating images now. I've only used AI to make a few logo's but even then it's impressive how creative they are. I think AI for art is just a new form of art, like the invention of the paint brush and computer.

I’m so glad to hear! There’s been a lot of hate out there, but I think a lot of it is due to misunderstanding and misinformation tbh

Fragment wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:46 am

Jim Burton wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:35 am If there is anything re. AOO we can do as a committee (i.e. publicizing examples of censorship, or reporting them to media), we can discuss that. I would also suggest contacting the Prostasia Foundation if you have not already, as they have the established record of working on this topic.

I already sent a personal email, not one on behalf of Mu. I was given a template response and told "they cannot discuss individual cases".

I think there may be ways to escalate that, though. In particular, having them clarify for the MAP community, what kind of content would be deemed unacceptable and why. Surely if they are permitting MAPs to use their site, they would appreciate our input in balancing safety and free expression. Imagine if they got it wrong in the opposite direction and failed to ban someone that was clearly using the site for abusive purposes.

Thank you friend! That’s a good idea, I may attempt to ask them about it.

Jim Burton wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:35 am The size of the politics forum on this board is well in-line with the smallest forums on the board, and we have had no aggressive conduct incidents to moderate thusfar. I'll be looking to place limitations on political debates if it ever spirals out of control or infects the publicly visible boards here.

There has been a surprising absence of radical pro-c's transitioning from PCMA to MAP Forum as PCMA has declined. They prefer a private space in which to be radical pro-c's.

This suggests to me that MAP Forum is a blank slate, and will be outsize influenced by whoever registers and contributes.

If there is anything re. AOO we can do as a committee (i.e. publicizing examples of censorship, or reporting them to media), we can discuss that. I would also suggest contacting the Prostasia Foundation if you have not already, as they have the established record of working on this topic.

I actually don’t know what PCMA is tbh

Good idea! Thanks, I’d like to get some info out about Ao3 being pretty hostile towards MAPs, but we might need more examples first? Idk

Fragment wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 2:46 am I hope for a world where instead of "pro-c" and "anti-c" being divided into two teams we can treat discussion around ideal and possible social and legal reform in a more nuanced way. There aren't only two options. And I don't think it's good to pretend things in terms of good/bad or black/white.

Yeah, I kinda agree. I mean I do think it’s an INSANE thing to be the first thing to focus on because like… it feels like a lot of Pro-Cs believe that in some distant future utopian culture, if everything in society was entirely restructured, adult-child sexual contact might not cause harm, and it’s like… 1.) no one actually knows the answer to that, despite what some people may claim, and 2.) like fuckin… who cares? That’s such a distant thing that maybe people should be focusing on change that is more immediate, helpful, and actually plausible

Just my thought

CloverAntics wrote: ↑Wed Oct 09, 2024 11:53 pm Yeah, I kinda agree. I mean I do think it’s an INSANE thing to be the first thing to focus on because like… it feels like a lot of Pro-Cs believe that in some distant future utopian culture, if everything in society was entirely restructured, adult-child sexual contact might not cause harm, and it’s like… 1.) no one actually knows the answer to that, despite what some people may claim, and 2.) like fuckin… who cares? That’s such a distant thing that maybe people should be focusing on change that is more immediate, helpful, and actually plausible

Although there are other, more achievable goals that we should be working on, I disagree with the idea that we should give up on pushing for some kind of legal reform. I think the pro-c/ anti-c debate is often framed in the wrong terms, it should be less focused on the morality of AMSC and instead be focused on how the state should response to cases of voluntary AMSC. I just posted this explaining in more detail why: https://forum.map-union.org/viewtopic.php?t=489