Mu will vote on "The Simple List" in 2025

[PorcelainLark]

I'm curious about your definition of 'people' here, because it seems oddly broad. Additionally, I'm not interested in convincing antis of anything. They are too far gone.

The issue is a matter of whether we have a choice of getting the public on our side, or not. There is likely no other way but to get the public to turn against antis, and towards us and minors.

This is where the root of the disagreement is. There isn't a meaningful distinction between the general public and antis. The general public are antis, so from my point of view you're trying to get the general public to turn against itself.

Considering my points on why societal opinion must change to allow many points on this list to succeed, how could the list possibly succeed without such a shift in thought?

Again, it has to be imposed against the will of the general public/antis.

That said, it's important that we don't give up on thinking about different means of influencing the public. Despite every attempt I have made to defeat that view I hold, I don't think we have a choice but to change hearts and minds.

I haven't given up on changing the hearts and minds of the public/antis, I just don't see that happening until the laws change. Choosing to try to change antis minds the way you are trying is fine, but I see it as talking to a brick wall.

tl;dr Trying to make a distinction between the general public and antis is wishful thinking in my opinion. They have to be forced not to be allowed to express hatred or aggression towards us by law. Over time, as MAPs can live more openly the prejudice would reduce as people get more used to us. Even laws that are low in effectiveness would move us in that direction.

[Lennon72]

Let me take these proposals one by one and respond accordingly

Build the MAP community, including reaching MAPs who are unaware of the community.

I do like this idea as there are many out there who do not know of our on line existence as a community. But then the question becomes " How do we find these people ?".

Achieve protected class status.

I couldn't agree more.

Access to legal services

Do we not have that already? Perhaps what we need are legal services specifically for MAPS.

Remove "pedophilic disorder" from the DSM and ICD.

Absolutely. Any disorder that we have has some from society, not the so called "disorder" itself.

Social justice - differentiating between rape/assault/coercion/violent crimes and statutory crimes.

Yes, we definitely need to look more into this. We too often fail to do that.

Social justice for minor MAPs, and those close in age.

Yes.

Ban conversion therapy

Conversion therapy is a disgrace and I am very surprised that there are still those out there who think it's a good idea. I say ban it entirely and let those who administer it be held accountable.

Meet the physiological needs of MAPs facing injustice/discrimination

Yes, absolutely. I think that the legal and mental health professionals should work together on that.

High-quality factual MAP media for public consumption.

Yes, we do need this. And we need to find ways to make it more accessible to the public. The internet alone is not enough.

Continued honest research into the various aspects of minor-attraction.

Absolutely. Just as there are different variants of gender identity and sexual/romantic orientations, there are different variants of MAPness.

Improved sex education that also talks about minor attractions.

Agreed. However, most of the information that people presently have about us is incorrect. So whatever we include in sex ed textbooks should be factual and not based on myth.

Legalization of all fictional sexual outlets, including loli/shota and dolls.

Absolutely. They hurt nobody and can very well be a way for some MAPS to avoid offending or re offending.

Social Justice - reform the sex offender registry.

Yes. We should very well work towards this goal. There are groups out there like NARSOL and WAR that are already working towards this goal. And as a registrant myself, I would like to eventually see the registry abolished altogether.

Combat false accusations, doxing, and myths of stranger danger.

Absolutely. MEDAL is already starting an action to combat doxing and false accusations. I am hoping to be of assistance with that .

Defeat the stigma

I believe that this can be done through proper education.

A credible organization to speak on and represent these goals to the public.

You get no argument from me here. What do people think about an umbrella organization?