Spain (until 2010s) and Argentina

[DonnyBerger]

I am curious about these 2 countries. I’ll explain:

SPAIN

Spain looks like a country that assimilated social taboo about MAP-AAM contacts later than most countries.

A politician called Javier Urra wanted to raise age of consent in late 90s and partially reached his goal and, due to his pressure, age of consent was raised from 12 to 13, but that wasn't enought for him. However, most of politicians disagreed with him because, according to Urra, they didn't want to supress young people's freedoms.

In 2010, Spanish writter Fernando Sanchez Drago released a new book telling that he had sexual contact with two 13 year old girls in 1967 (he was 31 then). That caused great controversy and he tried to "save the day" telling that was a fictional story. However, that action was legal in the 2010 Spain, so people felt indignation for something legal in their country, so social taboos didn't fit with law then. Some famous people of this country wrote and signed a letter suporting Sanchez Drago, and said that there wasn't a problem because is legal and with two minors who totally consented (!). One of the signers was Fernando Savater, a famous and mediatic spanish phillosopher, known mainly for his books and his activism against terrorism. 5 years later, age of consent was raised to 16 years old.

Given the historical data, I think that:

1) The fact that spanish politicians didn't want to raise age of consent in late 90s because they considered it was supressing young people's freedom show us a totally different society than USA. USA in late 90s experienced the Rind et al. controversy.
2) The fact that some famous people, specially Savater, said in 2010 (and not in a private/hidden context) that 13 years old teenagers can consent to sex in 2010 is surprising.
3) it looks like Sanchez Drago didn't expect that saying he had sexual contact with minors could lead him to cancelation.

If we consider these 3 points, it looks like sex with minors wasn't a big taboo in Spain until 2010 decade. Is a bit surprising.

ARGENTINA

Age of consent in Argentina is currently 13. Some TV shows show romantic relationships between minors and adults (Rebelde Way, Floricienta, Patito Feo), all of this series were produced in early 2000s by Cris Morena, a famous TV producer there. I think is surprising that age of consent is still so low in that country and Cris Morena not being canceled.

It looks like AAM-MAP relationships aren't still a big taboo in Argentina, and I find it a bit surprising. But I don't really know anything about how that issues are considered in Argentina or were considered in Spain before 2010 decade. So, this is my question:

AS MAPS, DO YOU KNOW MORE ABOUT HOW THIS ISSUES ARE CONSIDERED NOWADAYS IN ARGENTINA OR WERE CONSIDERED IN SPAIN AT 90S OR EARLY 2000s?

Thanks in advance. Best regards.

[aeterna91]

Here are two tweets from Argentine philosopher Roxana Kreimer, stating that a relationship between a teenager and an adult isn't an abuse. As you can see, the vast majority of the replies are people insulting her, so it doesn't seem to be a popular opinion in Argentina.

https://x.com/RoxanaKreimer/status/1639408475766759427

[Strato]

ARGENTINA

Age of consent in Argentina is currently 13. Some TV shows show romantic relationships between minors and adults (Rebelde Way, Floricienta, Patito Feo), all of this series were produced in early 2000s by Cris Morena, a famous TV producer there. I think is surprising that age of consent is still so low in that country and Cris Morena not being canceled.

It looks like AAM-MAP relationships aren't still a big taboo in Argentina, and I find it a bit surprising. But I don't really know anything about how that issues are considered in Argentina or were considered in Spain before 2010 decade. So, this is my question:

AS MAPS, DO YOU KNOW MORE ABOUT HOW THIS ISSUES ARE CONSIDERED NOWADAYS IN ARGENTINA OR WERE CONSIDERED IN SPAIN AT 90S OR EARLY 2000s?

Thanks in advance. Best regards.

“Age of consent in Argentina is currently 13.”

It is more complicated than that …

Wiki: “In Argentina, the age at which there are no restrictions for sexual activities is 18, and differing levels of protection are instituted for children under 13, 16 and 18, with the minimum age of consent being 13. Sexual acts with children aged between 13 and 18 are addressed by several laws, but none of these laws create a blank prohibition against such relations, but make them open to prosecution under certain circumstances, such as if the relationship is considered exploitative or if the minor was ‘corrupted’. Restrictions apply for sex with adolescents between the ages of 13 and 16. Charges can be brought only after a complaint by the minor, their parent or guardian, however, the State prosecutes when the minor has no parent or legal guardian, or when the offender is one of them.”

AgeOfConsent.net: “Individuals aged 17 or younger in Argentina are not legally able to consent to sexual activity. Because there is no close-in-age exemption in Argentina, it is possible for two individuals both under the age of 18 who willingly engage in intercourse to both be prosecuted for statutory rape.”

Incidentally, RIP Ivan Noel, who chose suicide rather than enduring lifelong persecution by those who insisted that his film art was instead child pornography, and that he was guilty of child abuse during the filming process which took place mostly in Argentina.

[DonnyBerger]

Thanks to both. About Argentina, I read (before posting) something about between 13 and 18 may be corruption, according to laws, but I didn't find the meaning of corruption in argentinian laws. So I voluntarily simplified the issue because it would be hard to investigate more and even with some nuances, age of consent is 13. Sorry if it was a mistake.

About Kreimer, I don't know the country of all people who insulted her, but at least some of them are from Argentina, because their argentinian spanish is clear.

Anyway, thank you again for reading and replying.

[FairBlueLove]

Wiki: “In Argentina, the age at which there are no restrictions for sexual activities is 18, and differing levels of protection are instituted for children under 13, 16 and 18, with the minimum age of consent being 13. Sexual acts with children aged between 13 and 18 are addressed by several laws, but none of these laws create a blank prohibition against such relations, but make them open to prosecution under certain circumstances, such as if the relationship is considered exploitative or if the minor was ‘corrupted’. Restrictions apply for sex with adolescents between the ages of 13 and 16. Charges can be brought only after a complaint by the minor, their parent or guardian, however, the State prosecutes when the minor has no parent or legal guardian, or when the offender is one of them.”

AgeOfConsent.net: “Individuals aged 17 or younger in Argentina are not legally able to consent to sexual activity. Because there is no close-in-age exemption in Argentina, it is possible for two individuals both under the age of 18 who willingly engage in intercourse to both be prosecuted for statutory rape.”

I'm a bit puzzled. Isn't the statement from AgeOfConsent.net a bit in contrast to what is written in the Wiki?

[Braulio]

Until very recently the minimum age of consent was 13. I was lucky I was about 28 and I was able to have sex with a girl of 13 and another one of 14 with consent, I had a better time than with the adults the truth.Very soft and beauty bodys

[Strato]

I'm a bit puzzled. Isn't the statement from AgeOfConsent.net a bit in contrast to what is written in the Wiki?

Yes FairBlueLove, ample scope for confusion. Moreover, a new term ‘adolescent’ appears in the Argentine Civil and Commercial Code (CCC) where it is defined as someone older than 13 years. The Code sets out rules of civil liability in cases of damages caused by minors in Argentina.

Interestingly, the CCC, in force since 2015, embraces liability of minors at younger ages. Although the Code maintains the age of 18 years old as the full age for attaching liability (reduced from 21 in 2009), the new Code imposes a progressive capacity for lower ages. Minors are represented by their legal representatives: their parents or their guardian, together with the Public Prosecutor.

Despite that representation, the CCC maintains the age of 10 years old from which minors can be held personally liable. In such cases, minors are held jointly liable with their parents, and parents are granted an action of reimbursement against their children, according to legal doctrine in case of compensation paid.

Old enough to be held liable for causing damage to property, but too young to be capable of consenting to mutual intimacy.

[BLueRibbon]

Wiki: “In Argentina, the age at which there are no restrictions for sexual activities is 18, and differing levels of protection are instituted for children under 13, 16 and 18, with the minimum age of consent being 13. Sexual acts with children aged between 13 and 18 are addressed by several laws, but none of these laws create a blank prohibition against such relations, but make them open to prosecution under certain circumstances, such as if the relationship is considered exploitative or if the minor was ‘corrupted’. Restrictions apply for sex with adolescents between the ages of 13 and 16. Charges can be brought only after a complaint by the minor, their parent or guardian, however, the State prosecutes when the minor has no parent or legal guardian, or when the offender is one of them.”

AgeOfConsent.net: “Individuals aged 17 or younger in Argentina are not legally able to consent to sexual activity. Because there is no close-in-age exemption in Argentina, it is possible for two individuals both under the age of 18 who willingly engage in intercourse to both be prosecuted for statutory rape.”

I'm a bit puzzled. Isn't the statement from AgeOfConsent.net a bit in contrast to what is written in the Wiki?

AgeOfConsent.net massively oversimplifies in its interpretations. Do not trust this site with anything important.

[DonnyBerger]

Until very recently the minimum age of consent was 13. I was lucky I was about 28 and I was able to have sex with a girl of 13 and another one of 14 with consent, I had a better time than with the adults the truth.Very soft and beauty bodys

That was in Spain or Argentina? It was legal but... what about social views of your acts? Did you feel stigma? Are you talking about 90s or early 2000s? Thanks for your participation