American MAPs should disown 'their' country

[BLueRibbon]

There are still, shockingly, a number of American MAPs who continue to speak proudly of the country in which they happened to be born. They parrot tired old phrases about liberty and justice, as if these ideals had ever been intended for 'people' like them. Why? It could be a habit instilled via endless salutes and anthems at school. It could be pure fear, the imagining of a greater evil beyond its borders. It could be a desperate clinging to faint shreds of hope, like an abused dog that salivates at the feet of its evil master, whimpering in terror while deluding itself with the belief that just maybe it will one day get a pat on the head. But whatever the reason, this patriotism amounts to the same thing: the inexplicable, delusional support of one's own persecution.

Even America's extreme laws, with their utterly insane sentences, fail to truly illustrate the full extent of the madness to which MAPs are subjected. And while the British may have laid the groundwork in 1885 when they raised the age of consent and exported their puritanical model across the empire, it was the United States that took those new ideas and expanded and truly globalized them, creating the absolute hellscape under which we are all now brutalized, both in America and increasingly across the rest of the world.

It was the 1980s that marked the beginning of the full-scale moral panic in the US. The since disproven Satanic Panic led to a modern witch hunt, featuring crazed articles in the press and a brand new folk devil for the masses. America's fledgling psychology industry quickly exploited this new wave of hysteria, rapidly churning out a library of junk research on 'Child Sexual Abuse' that made no attempt to distinguish inherent harm from the much more common secondary harm caused by the puritan-derived aversion to consensual AMSC. The NAMBLA revolutionaries, rather than being taken seriously in what was otherwise a period of sexual revolution both in America and in Europe, were condemned as grotesque monsters who sought to inflict horrific harm on children. And thus, a new narrative of the villainous and soul-destroying pedophile was born, to be exported across the world along with the rest of America's vile cancer.

America has not yet criminalized mere attraction to minors, but that's likely only because the powers that be haven’t yet found a constitutionally acceptable excuse to do so. If the law could criminalize a MAP's inner life, their feelings, or their self-awareness, it probably would. The public would cheer it on, the liberal-minded all the while waving their rainbow and BLM flags and patting themselves on the back for being 'tolerant'. And given the extent to which the latest administration has violated the constitution unhindered, all it will take is a similarly-minded dictator - one who isn't a likely MAP himself - to actually go through with the arrest and incarceration of anyone who could be identified as being attracted to minors.

Even though admitting that you are a MAP is not yet illegal, and not yet a reason for abduction by the anti-pedo version of ICE, it is often considered cause for intervention without any credible accusation of wrongdoing. Merely disclosing your identity, or being suspected, is enough for someone to decide that a report must be filed, whether to a boss, a school, a therapist, a platform, or the police. It doesn’t matter if you’ve never hurt nobody and never committed an actual crime. Simply existing is seen as an act of evil, a moral aberration, a thing that needs to be killed or silenced.

Some MAPs, in a desperate attempt to salvage any slight semblance of connection to a society that seeks their brutal evisceration, try to cope with this oppression by aligning themselves with the very boots that stomp on them. A kind of Stockholm Syndrome, essentially. They tell themselves that if they stay quiet and follow the rules, or better yet talk about how they would never act on their feelings because that would be the absolute worst thing in the world, they might be allowed to squander a pitiful existence of loneliness and misery. And still, even with such monkish levels of sacrifice, it needs only the slightest suspicion, accusation, or possession of a questionably posed picture of a swimsuit model, for that life to come irreparably crashing down.

Some American MAPs defend 'their' country on the basis that other countries are the same or even worse, but that excuse doesn’t hold up despite their nation's best attempts at exporting its signature hysterical terror. The USA is not just another repressive country; it is the architect of MAP oppression and incarceration, crushing those within its own borders and acting as the most fanatical sponsor of similar policies worldwide. Being the brutish globalizing bully that it is, America remains less than content with any country unwilling to treat MAPs in the harshest possible manner. Through treaties, intelligence-sharing, trade deals, and diplomatic pressure, the US does everything it can to push foreign governments into adopting American laws, definitions, and punishments. It uses its dominance in tech, finance, and foreign aid to demand alignment. Countries that once had milder and more realistic approaches have been shamed, threatened, or paid into submission. The world is being manipulated into a mini America, under pressure, surveillance, and threats.

Nonetheless, the US remains the worst of the worst. In numerous developed European nations, the age of consent is set at 14 or 15, and legal frameworks such as that of Germany acknowledge adolescent agency in ways US courts could never imagine. Sentencing in virtually every country other than America is dramatically different, too. Penalties for non-contact offenses are much shorter, and alternatives to incarceration are routine. Life sentences for possession of images, many of which were pirated after being produced many years ago, is a uniquely and disgustingly American concept. Even the United Kingdom, arguably the birthplace of modern puritanism and now deeply hostile to MAPs in public rhetoric, almost never imposes long prison sentences for mere possession of criminalized images. When prison is involved, countries like Norway and Sweden maintain humane facilities for everyone, as opposed to the horrendous for-profit monstrosities operated by the US.

If you're an American MAP and continue to support 'your' country, take a step back. Don't grovel for love from your abuser. Don't support a nation that has funded and exported the most horrific forms of child abuse while throwing people like you in prison for looking at naughty images. Instead of feeling the urge to cheer for an institution that doesn't want you, out of a desperate and frankly pathetic desire to be a part of it, have the strength to stand up and speak the truth:

"Fuck America. The world would be better off without it."

[jeffychubchaser29]

A stranger on the internet has demanded I disown my country. Looks like I have to do it.

LMAO. Yeah right, nice try mate.

Your scathing and harsh tone is not the best/most productive way to get your point across...in fact, it has made me lose any thought to consider your view point.

No stranger on the internet is going to tell me how to live my life or who I support or not.

The US has bigger fish to fry right now than worrying about our injustices.

[Strato]

"If you're an American MAP and continue to support 'your' country, take a step back. Don't grovel for love from your abuser. Don't support a nation that has funded and exported the most horrific forms of child abuse while throwing people like you in prison for looking at naughty images. Instead of feeling the urge to cheer for an institution that doesn't want you, out of a desperate and frankly pathetic desire to be a part of it, have the strength to stand up and speak the truth: 'Fuck America. The world would be better off without it.' "

Have to agree with you on much of what you say BLueRibbon. Unfortunately, such foolish pride is the result of decades of in-bred ignorance, idolatry, narcissism, greed and paranoia. America long lost its rightful place to co-exist with those of us who prioritise empathy, good-will and love towards others, irrespective of age, nationality or creed. The treatment of MAPS stateside and the contempt it shows for everyone else living beyond its borders, is emblematic of the insanity that afflicts the 'good' 'ol U.S. of A.

[Officerkrupke]

You have a good point but I’m grateful we have freedom of speech in America vs other countries.

[Fragment]

Reposting my reply from BoyChat here:

I don't get what's so hard about hating your country of birth. It's not like it's a choice you made.

I have no problem hating mine.

The American constitution still has things of value to say.

Free speech and free association are still marginally more protected in the US than in other anglo countries.

But the crime and punishment system?

It's almost definitely the worst developed country for BLs and GLs. Though, ironically, the aforementioned constitutional protections also make it the most likely place for reform.

But maybe some MAPs love being American because of all the non-MAP things that make the country great. America does still has a lot of advantages over many other countries, but honestly apart from "most military spending" I'm not sure that it is a clear winner over most other developed countries. The economy is obviously the largest in the world (though on a per capita basis it's fairly middling). Education? Healthcare? Cost of living? Natural environment? There are no areas where I see the US as a clear winner.

Obviously people living in the US that have grown up there have had many great experiences. There are many great people, great places and great experiences in any country. But some American attitudes remind me of a guy I knew in my home town that once said "this is the greatest place in the whole world! I've never been anywhere else and I don't need to!"

It's a powerhouse country that has been able to use soft imperialism to shape the course of the rest of the world. But unless you're a tech entrepreneur, I can't see any reason a BL or GL would be proud of it as a country and be happy (rather than resigned) to live there.

Cashew42, who was interviewed by Little Nicky, just got sentenced to 15 years for images. I'm facing 2 years in Japan for contact offenses. "America is the greatest country in the world". Or something like that.

Every country is fucked. Every country has problems. But the US IS the most powerful country in the world. So that just amplifies the problems and spreads them abroad like a disease.

[BLueRibbon]

A stranger on the internet has demanded I disown my country. Looks like I have to do it.

LMAO. Yeah right, nice try mate.

Your scathing and harsh tone is not the best/most productive way to get your point across...in fact, it has made me lose any thought to consider your view point.

No stranger on the internet is going to tell me how to live my life or who I support or not.

Frankly, you are a perfect example of what I was referring to here:

It could be a desperate clinging to faint shreds of hope, like an abused dog that salivates at the feet of its evil master, whimpering in terror while deluding itself with the belief that just maybe it will one day get a pat on the head.

In your posts on this and other boards, you have shown yourself to be absolutely desperate for love from those around you. America has broken you into feeling unloved and unwanted with its horrific oppression of MAPs. Rather than turn around and bite your abuser back, you seek his shade, all the while he's coming for you, slowly but surely.

It's so terribly sad.

The US has bigger fish to fry right now than worrying about our injustices.

Are you referring to your country's illegal attacks on a country whose regime is primarily a result of its own disgraceful meddling?

[jeffychubchaser29]

A stranger on the internet has demanded I disown my country. Looks like I have to do it.

LMAO. Yeah right, nice try mate.

Your scathing and harsh tone is not the best/most productive way to get your point across...in fact, it has made me lose any thought to consider your view point.

No stranger on the internet is going to tell me how to live my life or who I support or not.

Frankly, you are a perfect example of what I was referring to here:

It could be a desperate clinging to faint shreds of hope, like an abused dog that salivates at the feet of its evil master, whimpering in terror while deluding itself with the belief that just maybe it will one day get a pat on the head.

In your posts on this and other boards, you have shown yourself to be absolutely desperate for love from those around you. America has broken you into feeling unloved and unwanted with its horrific oppression of MAPs. Rather than turn around and bite your abuser back, you seek his shade, all the while he's coming for you, slowly but surely.

It's so terribly sad.

The US has bigger fish to fry right now than worrying about our injustices.

Are you referring to your country's illegal attacks on a country whose regime is primarily a result of its own disgraceful meddling?

Meh...idrc what some foreign stranger has to say about me. You come across as a know it all. So from now on please ignore my posts and I'll ignore yours. You're irrelevant to me and I'm irrelevant to you. Idk about you, but I come to these boards to have FUN and make friends(btw political views should not be what determines a friendship), not argue politics. Have a great day sir.

[Fragment]

Meh...idrc what some foreign stranger has to say about me. You come across as a know it all. So from now on please ignore my posts and I'll ignore yours. You're irrelevant to me and I'm irrelevant to you. Idk about you, but I come to these boards to have FUN and make friends(btw political views should not be what determines a friendship), not argue politics. Have a great day sir.

Why are you even replying when you're not engaging with any of the points made and just randomly calling one of the mods a "stranger" (before going on to say you're here to make friends. Contradiction much?)

On what basis are you proud of your country?

(PS- this should probably get moved to the Politics and Debate sub-forum)

[jeffychubchaser29]

Meh...idrc what some foreign stranger has to say about me. You come across as a know it all. So from now on please ignore my posts and I'll ignore yours. You're irrelevant to me and I'm irrelevant to you. Idk about you, but I come to these boards to have FUN and make friends(btw political views should not be what determines a friendship), not argue politics. Have a great day sir.

Why are you even replying when you're not engaging with any of the points made and just randomly calling one of the mods a "stranger" (before going on to say you're here to make friends. Contradiction much?)

On what basis are you proud of your country?

(PS- this should probably get moved to the Politics and Debate sub-forum)

On what basis am I proud of my country.?
Cause I want to. Just like you want to hate MY country.
I'm done with this argument. I've said all I wanted to say. I pray to the gods y'all find peace and happiness.

[PorcelainLark]

I've felt this thread has been a bit too heated for a while. Please try to keep in mind rule 7:

Do not act in bad faith, such as by harassing posters you may dislike, or unnecessarily derailing productive discussions.

Please try not escalate things further, people.